Leaving Teaching for a New Career in EdTech with Raven Wilson (Ep 28)
Teaching is often viewed as a career that people stay in for, well, the entirety of their working years. But what if teaching isn’t right for you? What if you want to take a leap into a new career? Where do you start?
In today’s episode, I’m talking with Raven Wilson about her transition from elementary school teacher to customer success manager in the field of EdTech (educational technology). Her leap has led her to also serving as a coach and mentor to other educators who want to leave teaching. She started a group called Black Educators Transition to provide Black educators with a supportive community and the tools and resources needed to embark on a new career path.
She shares her advice on knowing what interests you and how to translate your experience to a new role. She talks about the patience necessary for the process of networking, researching jobs, and interviewing. And mostly important, she reminds you that you have to really want something new and different for yourself and be proactive with your leap.
In this episode, you’ll learn...
Raven’s background and current role [01:52]
What it’s like to be a customer success manager in EdTech [03:03]
How Raven learned that teaching wasn’t the right fit for her [04:56]
How COVID affected her career decisions [06:55]
How her inner voice told her to take the leap [09:21]
What made it difficult for her to leave teaching [10:54]
About the identity shift that comes with taking a leap [14:02]
About Raven’s process that led her to learning what other careers are possible for teachers [16:28]
The importance of researching your options and asking yourself questions about your skills and interests [20:02]
How to hone your experience and craft your resume to align with the job you seek [23:14]
What she learned in the job search and interview process [27:17]
Raven’s experience with interviewing and eventually landing a job in EdTech [30:02]
About her passion for helping other Black educators who want to leave teaching [34:52]
The questions she gets most often from teachers interested in leaving the profession and her advice to them [42:34]
That losing summers off isn’t so bad thanks to flexible PTO in other fields [48:01]
Why it’s okay to switch jobs and move companies [49:54]
What Raven wishes she knew before she took her leap [52:02]
Raven’s advice for those interested in taking a similar leap [53:05]
If you’re considering your own courageous career leap, be sure to tune into this episode.
Standing at your own crossroads and ready to get clear on your direction? Apply for my Catalyst Coaching Program today!
If you are at that sort of stage where you are trying to figure out what do you want out of your next role, and you want to do some self reflection, I have something that is going to help you do that. Check out my self-paced digital course, Illuminate Your Career Path in 5 Steps. Five different modules will take you through step by step how to do some of this initial planning and thinking about what you want next for your career path.
I want you to know about my new free change planner. This planner is for you if you'd like to make a significant change in life or work, but you're feeling kind of stuck. My change planner will help you get the clarity you need to take your next steps. Inside, I'll show you how to understand what you really want and why it's important, how to face your fears constructively so they don't hold you back, and this planner also has a scenario cruncher. I hope you get all possible scenarios out of your head so you can find the right one for you!
Connect with Lisa
Connect with Raven
Join Black Educators Transition on Facebook
Raven’s Bio
Raven Wilson is a former elementary teacher turned Customer Success Manager. Leaving teaching was one of the hardest but best choices she ever made. Since her transition to edTech, she has more freedom and flexibility which is all she ever wanted.
Links mentioned in this episode…
Transcript of Episode 28: Leaving Teaching for a New Career in EdTech with Raven Wilson
Raven Wilson:
I crafted a group called Black Educators Transition to do the same, to help teachers who are looking to go to kind of give them the resources. This is where you need to start. This is what you need to do. Not holding anyone's hand, because, again, you have to do the work yourself, but this is a beginning place for you to start your transition.
Lisa Hoashi:
Welcome to Leap Like Me. If you can't shake the feeling that you're not on the right path, if you feel called to change things up, but don't know how to begin, you're in the right place. I'm your host, Lisa Hoashi, and my specialty is coaching people at those crossroads moments in life when you feel called to take a new direction. Sometimes that means taking a leap. I want to share practical advice and inspiration for your leaps and how to keep going after your dreams in a challenging world. This season, we're talking all about career leaps. Come along for the conversation.
Lisa Hoashi:
Hello, everyone and welcome to Leap Like Me. I'm your host, Lisa Hoashi. Today's guest is a former elementary school teacher, turn customer success manager in Newport News, Virginia. She says that leaving teaching was one of the hardest and best decisions that she made. And since her transition to ed tech, she's found a lot more flexibility and freedom which is what she really wanted. Please welcome to this show, Raven Wilson. Welcome Raven.
Raven Wilson:
Yay. Thank you so much for having me, Lisa. I'm really excited to be here.
Lisa Hoashi:
Me too. Well, thank you. So let's just kind of jump in. First, I would love to hear about what are you doing right now? What's your job like? And a little bit about you, if you'd like to add a little bit of your own background too.
Raven Wilson:
Yes. I'll give my personal background. I'm Raven, like mentioned. I am 30 years old and I live in Virginia. Well, I worked with kids forever. Like any teacher or educator, probably summer camps, preschools and all that. But I was actually a classroom teacher for about six years in elementary ed. I taught first, second and a little... And I was a math interventionist. So I taught K-5 because I was really working with those students. It was my dream career. Right? It was what I wanted to do since I was probably eight being the boss with my sisters.
Raven Wilson:
I recently left the classroom about a year. No, like it makes a year next week. Next week would be officially a year since I've been out of the classroom. It's crazy. And now I am a customer success manager in ed tech. Even though I live in Newport News, my company is based out of Boston, but I work remote. So I get to do what I do in the comfort of my own home.
Lisa Hoashi:
Awesome. Well, so it sounds like you both kind of really thought you would go into teaching from the beginning so we can kind of go there in a minute. But first I'd love to hear a little bit more about like what does your job entail right now? What do you enjoy about it? Tell us a little bit more about what you do.
Raven Wilson:
So it's one of my favorite questions, like what is a customer success manager? Because even when before I got into it, I'm like, "I don't want to be on the phone like a call center person." But really what I do is in the name, I make sure our customers are successful at using our product. So for any big software company and if it's a software as a service, we're giving it out like Netflix. They have a service. They have a software. So they probably have customer success managers. We want to make sure our customers are happy.
Raven Wilson:
And what that really looks like depends on the product. Because I work at ed tech, my customers and clients are teachers, administrators in that field. And what makes them happy is, are they using it with their students? Are they finding best practices? How this really going to look realistic on the day to day when we have everything else on our plate?
Raven Wilson:
So my job is really coming up with ways to make sure that they are successful at using it in the classroom, in their districts and a lot of data onboarding. I'm getting them welcomed, "Welcome to our company." I want them trained. I want to support them. Lots and lots of emails day to day. I think my favorite part of this job is I get to do a little training, which feels like teaching to me, but with adults. So it's fun. Right? So I'm talking to adults all day long and how to use this. And because my clients and customers are educators, I will say, "This is what I would've done in my classroom." Like, "Oh, you're an elementary educator? This is how this would be successful with them." So it's really cool to kind of get back in that sense.
Lisa Hoashi:
So you can really use your expertise in a different way and your teaching in a different way?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. So I still feel like a teacher at heart.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. So tell us a little bit about how did your teaching career go? As you started to get into it, when did the signs start to emerge that maybe it wasn't the right fit for you?
Raven Wilson:
I would say my first year, but the blazing glaring signs didn't come for a couple years later. So just like every teacher, you go with your teacher prep and all those things in college and you're like, "Yes, I am ready." You do student teaching and you are ready to go. And it is nothing like what you thought it was going to be. You're like, what's happening? What is happening? This is not student teaching. This was not like college. This is just something else. And you just kind of like sink or float your first year. You really do. And you come with the community.
Raven Wilson:
So my first year I loved my school, but it was a really tough school. So I had a lot of students who just needed a lot of love. But with that love, there came like a lot of profanity, a lot of throwing items. Just a lot of needs that they had. And in that school, I was like, "This is hard. I don't know how people do this." But I stuck it out. Everyone kept saying, "It just gets better. This is your first year." So I went to the second year and it didn't get better. And not only it didn't get better, I got pregnant with my son and I'm like, "No, I'm exhausted now. I don't want to be as exhausted with a child. I want to have energy for my own child." So I end up leaving that school like a lot of teachers do. They say like, "If it doesn't work here, maybe it'll work somewhere else."
Lisa Hoashi:
Different school.
Raven Wilson:
Exactly. Different school, different division, different demographics. So I went to a completely different school. Very suburban, high parent support, PTA. I didn't know that existed. It was amazing. It was an amazing school year. My son was a newborn. I could have did that job in my sleep, but something was just missing. I was already thinking about leaving my second year and I was like, "I don't know. I don't know if I want to continue..." My third year, "I don't want to continue doing this." So that Christmas, December 20... When did COVID start, 2020?
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. March. So we're also having the anniversary.
Raven Wilson:
So December 2019, I went to my principal's. Christmas break is coming and I was like, "Hey, I'm going to put in my notice. I don't know what I'm going to do yet, but I want to go to tech. I don't know how, but I feel like this is my last year. And this coming here was to test out to see if it was teaching or if it was just the school." And she said, "Okay, Raven. Thank you for letting me know." I was going to finish out the year. COVID hit in March. Life really changed when COVID hit. I was home teaching. My son was home for a little bit. That in itself, I was like, "No way. No. No way. I cannot do that."
Raven Wilson:
And then I get just scared. I can't switch careers now. It's just unknown. I need to just stay put. So then I decided to go back but not teach anymore. I wanted to get out of the classroom. So then I became an interventionist. So I spent the whole next year, 2020, 2021 being an interventionist. And back of my head, I'm like, still like, "I can't do this." I'm out of the classroom. My job is great, but something is still... I still want more.
Raven Wilson:
So about December 2020, I decided I was like, "All right, nope." I just researched jobs. I really connected with a lot of people. And then I made the move to leave. So by that April 2021, I was out of the classroom.
Lisa Hoashi:
Wow. Well, so it's really interesting that you hit that moment right in the pandemic where... I mean, you're taking me back there of just like the intense uncertainty. We did not know what was going to happen in the world. Really tricky time to make any kind of leaps or moves. It was just like... Yeah, I mean, I work with clients to make big changes in their lives. Right? And they were just kind of... Then all the plans we had made, all the things we were working on, it was like what to do now. Right? And there was a little bit of a holding pattern because we just had to figure out what was going to happen.
Raven Wilson:
Everyone's job felt a little unstable. You just don't know. What if my husband got laid off? And I already knew teaching would be solid. Teaching was always going to be there. So it was that, what if it's not the right time to go? Yeah, it was a scary time. It's crazy. It was two years ago, but it was, yeah.
Lisa Hoashi:
Well, so then it sounds like pretty soon after, as soon as you were like, okay, I think things are stable enough that I can start to make my move.
Raven Wilson:
Yep.
Lisa Hoashi:
That you start setting things into motion.
Raven Wilson:
Yep. That little inner voice in me never died. It got louder once things settled down and I'm like, "Okay, it's time." And my husband was like, "All right, let's do it. You've only been talking about this for years and like, it's time." And I really got to make the move. Again, it's like the hardest choice, but it's been the best choice.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. Well, and I appreciate that you bring up the little voice because of my years of doing this and having the inner voice as well, I've noticed that if the inner voice starts talking like that, you're going to have to pay attention to it sooner or later. It gets more insistent, more louder. So that was happening for you.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. For me, the inner voice came in different... It'll be in my dreams. I'm like, "Oh my gosh. It's not stopping." First, I'm like, it's just me because I want to, but it's in my dreams. It's when I'm at work. It's when I'm doing something. I heard it so much that I'm like, "I really have to start listening to myself because [inaudible 00:10:18] was talking to me. It's just inside of me.
Lisa Hoashi:
And what was it saying?
Raven Wilson:
It was saying, "Leave, Raven." It really kept saying like, "This is not your passion. You've spent your time here. It's time to go." A lot of people in my circle or my community that knew I was teaching would say like, "No, you can't leave teaching. Why would you leave teaching? What about your retirement? No one leaves teaching. What are you going to do?" It was really saying like, "Don't listen to them. Go. You know yourself better. You feel it? Go. Go, go, go." It was saying that like, "Ignore everybody else, just go."
Lisa Hoashi:
All right. So you have an inner voice saying go. You have like a surrounding though. And it sounds like within the profession, there's some pressure to stay.
Raven Wilson:
Oh, yeah. It's a big-
Lisa Hoashi:
I didn't know this about teaching. Can you tell us about it?
Raven Wilson:
[inaudible 00:11:09] Love them. Greatest experience. But once you're in there and when you want to leave, it's the looks that you get. It's just like you hate the kids. You get so many different people's opinions and views. And it's really like, "No, I don't hate anything. I just love me more." And that's really hard to drown those voices out. A lot of teachers find that it's hard.
Lisa Hoashi:
Is it because teachers kind of see it as like a calling and it's like...
Raven Wilson:
Yes.
Lisa Hoashi:
I guess it also reminds me, I used to work in non-profits. And so it was like the mission driven work, right?
Raven Wilson:
Yes.
Lisa Hoashi:
Like we're working toward really important causes. How could you be selfish and not put all in for the cause, right?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. I had this mindset too, but if I leave who's else is going to do this with the kids? Someone else will do it. I am not going to save the world by myself. Teaching is a community and that's a big thing. It's like, "I can't leave my kids because they're not going to survive without me. They need me. They need great teachers." When you're ready to leave you become less and less of a great teacher. If anyone's ready to leave and take that leap, they know their love for teaching just diminishes.
Raven Wilson:
So I'm actually not being a great teacher, but yeah, it's hard. When you tell people in the education profession or nonprofit that you're going away, you get some really... You get all those type of looks. "Really? Why would you do that?"
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. You mentioned that it was one of the hardest decisions and also a really good decision for you. So what was some of the conflict? I mean, we're kind of hearing it now, but what was the conflict that was making it really difficult?
Raven Wilson:
So I think, number one, it really was that mindset of like, "I'm going to leave my students. How am I going to forgive myself first of all, for leaving them? What are they going to do?" You feel bad. You feel bad for leaving your team and your school because I'm taking a body out which puts extra stress. Even though they may have a substitute or maybe they will hire eventually, or maybe they won't, I'm putting extra stress on my team.
Raven Wilson:
So I'm thinking it's that outer thinking about everyone else like, "Oh man, what are they going to do? And then what are people going to say?" A big one for me was, how can I leave something that I planned for? I knew I wanted to do this career. This is what I thought I was going to teach at the same school as my kids. This is my life. I have my summers for the next 40 years planned out. How am I going to leave something that I saw a track for.
Raven Wilson:
And another one for other people, but what must have mean was retirement. What am I going to do to retire? Where's the money going to come from? Is anything else going to be stable? So those are my very hard thing to get over. The biggest one for me, again, like I said, was I'm leaving something that I thought I was going to do forever. I'm very much so a planner. So when things go off track for me, I'm like... So that was hard for me to let go because I don't like to let go of things that I planned for.
Lisa Hoashi:
That's an interesting one. I mean, one thing that I talk about sometimes with people is like that there's like an identity shift. I wonder if that's kind of part of like I'm a teacher. I had a plan for my life and now I have to say, "Whoops, oh, I made a mistake or I changed my mind." Sometimes it's hard to say publicly in a way of like, I changed my mind or this isn't working out for me.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. I think if you ask a lot of people who are... Just like you ask moms, if you ask a lot of people who are they, their identity becomes around like, "Oh, I'm a teacher. I'm a mom. I'm a wife." Who am I outside that identity? With me being a mom and a wife, that never is a part of my identity to myself. But as a teacher, that really was my identity. I don't know why, but it was always like, "Oh, I'm Raven."
Raven Wilson:
That was the first thing I would say, "I'm a teacher." And now I'm like, "Wait, I'm so much more than that. I'm so much more than a mom and a wife. And I'm so much more than a teacher." So the identity shift was huge.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. So it sounds like you discovered, like, "I can also grow beyond this. I can be more than this."
Raven Wilson:
Teaching is not just like monolith. It looks different in different ways that I do it. I can teach my son now. I can teach it within training. I'm not teaching within the classroom, but you still never lose that. I found a new identity and it's beautiful. I'm more than just one thing. I read this quote the other day, it's like, "We need to release the idea that we have to do something for 30 years. If we say it, when we're 18, who made that rule that when we're 50, we still want that same thing? We have the right to change our mind all the..." I don't like anything that I used to like when I'm 18. Why did I think I would still like the career? It's okay to change our mind.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. It's true that teaching is still like one of those professions that people tend to... It's one of those things where people don't jump around or that there's... Maybe they go from school to school, but not as much as like going from company to company, for example.
Raven Wilson:
No, they stay for years. It's crazy.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. So can you tell us about what... Do you feel like there was a moment where you made a decision or did it feel a little bit more like a process? How did kind of things start getting in setting in motion for you?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. It's definitely more of a process than a decision. The decision to leave, that's something different. That's coming to terms with yourself. But to actually leave is a process because with teaching, again, teaching in itself, it puts you in a box where you don't even know other things exist outside of teaching. When you ask teachers if they want to do anything else, you're like, what else would you want to do? And they usually say like, "I don't know what else I could do. All I can do is teach."
Raven Wilson:
Which is not even true when you can do so much more. When I first start leaving, I was like, "What can teachers do?" The other jobs that popped up were like training, teach more. It was never another type of... Never more jobs. So finding out other careers-
Lisa Hoashi:
And getting the sensation just by your hand gestures, so you actually Googled that. Is that right?
Raven Wilson:
I did. I did it in January.
Lisa Hoashi:
Like your 3rd term. What else can you just do?
Raven Wilson:
What teachers do. I kid you not. You should see what pops up on Google. Hopefully, it's better now because it's been two years. I'm like, "I don't want to do that." It's like, "Be a counselor, teach." I'm like, "Okay, so you have to figure out what careers are out there. That's one of the hardest parts. We can do more. What else can we do?" And also figuring out what do you like to do? What do I like to do outside of teaching? Outside of my students?" I guess I'll say that. And really learning how to network, getting on LinkedIn. Teachers don't have LinkedIn. Getting on LinkedIn, getting your resume correct, and then applying and interviewing for jobs. So that is a whole process, once you figure out like, "Okay, it's time to go. Now let's get this process started."
Lisa Hoashi:
Yes, I 100%, like this is the process I'm often helping people with and going along with them and guiding them through. So okay. The first step, it sounded like a couple things are going on at the same time. What is out there, right?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. What do you want to do?
Lisa Hoashi:
And what do I like to do? Right?
Raven Wilson:
Yep.
Lisa Hoashi:
So how did you start figuring those things out?
Raven Wilson:
Google. So I kid you not. That me typing is Googling. And the first couple of jobs that popped up, I'm like, "Cool. I can do that," which is instructional design. That's really what's going to pop up if you Google what can teachers do besides teach is instructional design. So that's what I went... I'm like first job, cool. I can be an instructional designer. I read the qualifications and it seemed like just creating lessons, right? Just creating courses. I'm like, "Oh, I do that every day. I can do that."
Raven Wilson:
So I went down that path. I went down that instructional design path. I made a LinkedIn because that's another thing, it's like, get on LinkedIn. Connect with instructional... I'm like... I got on LinkedIn. I connected with other instructional designers. I found teachers who were now instructional designers. And I heard about their data and I'm like, "Wow, yeah. I want to do that. That seems great. You make how much money?" All that talk. And then I took courses for that, free courses. I paid for courses. I did everything I wanted to do, and I realized I did not like it.
Raven Wilson:
So I said two things. Figure out what you want. Figure out what's out there and figure out what you want to do. I did not like instructional design. I was going to these groups and meetings and I was like bored to tears. Kid you not, bored to tears. I was to the point where I'm like, "Maybe I'll just stay in teaching. This is just not good." I met with someone, a connection on LinkedIn and we maybe talked for 10 minutes. She's like, "Can you tell me again why do you want to do instructional design?"
Raven Wilson:
I didn't know this lady. I was like, "Because that's like what teachers can do." She's like, "You guys can do so much more." She's like, "Do you know there's a whole of like all these jobs out there?" And I'm like, "No, what else can I... What was out there?" And she's like, started naming off things. She's like, "You need to do your research. You really need to search companies. You need to search blah, blah, blah." And look at their jobs and read the descriptions and find what you like.
Raven Wilson:
She asked me some questions that really was just like, "What do you like about teaching besides the kids?" She's like, "Do you like creating lessons?" I was not the teacher that created lessons, first of all. So why did I think I wanted to do that for a career? And I'm like, "No." She's like, "Do you like writing curriculum?" I'm like, "Ooh, no." She's like, "What do you like?" I was like, "I like teaching. I like actually presenting, talking to people." She's like so professional development.
Raven Wilson:
So she really crafted my brain to think outside of the kids, what parts of teaching. Am I an introvert? Are you an extrovert? Questions like that, that really helped me craft my career. So you have to find the jobs and find the biggest thing. What do you like to do?
Lisa Hoashi:
Amazing. Refresh my memory with this. This is a woman you just met at LinkedIn. Awesome.
Raven Wilson:
She was a former teacher. I was listening to everything. I read books and podcasts. Listen to a podcast on teacher to trainer or instructional design, something like that. And she was on there and I found her on LinkedIn and I was like, "Hey, I read your book or did something on podcast. I just wanted to tell you your story is inspiration to me. Thank you so much." And then she was like, "Anytime. If you want to chat, let me know." And of course I'm like, "Yeah."
Raven Wilson:
So I chat with her and she's like, "Here's a Zoom link." And we were on Zoom for about, I want to say an hour. But the first 10 minutes she was like, "You don't give me instructional designer vibes." So I'm like, "Oh, okay". So that changed my whole trajectory.
Lisa Hoashi:
That's awesome. I love hearing about people helping each other out that way. That's a role that I have. I mean, that's my job is that I help people ask them that questions and try to pull out the same thing of what have they liked with in their most recent job. What have they like kind of historically like to other jobs when they were a kid. Just trying to pull out those things of what pieces they enjoy.
Raven Wilson:
It's hard to find those common themes.
Lisa Hoashi:
Because what you want is the job that's the right fit. It's great that you got signs early on, that like you were bored to death at the... And that you found someone who could help you with that. Yeah.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah.
Lisa Hoashi:
Really awesome.
Raven Wilson:
Very thankful for that all the time.
Lisa Hoashi:
Okay. So she was like kind of an industry insider and could give you some ideas of like, you're not such a great fit for that, but you are a better fit for this.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah.
Lisa Hoashi:
And then where did you go from there?
Raven Wilson:
So once you told me kind of like, "These are more up your realm. You probably should do more research into these positions." Then I started researching customer success, client support, trainer professional. All of the things that were under the same umbrella. Right? Client facing.
Lisa Hoashi:
Like people? Yeah.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. Very much so client facing, talking to people, presenting. Not really having to upskill. So that was good. That was where I wanted to go. Then I started looking at the job descriptions like, "Okay, can I apply for this? What do I need?" And my resume, that was the next step. Right? Okay, this is what the job says. Once you kind of read through that jargon, you're like, "Do I have what it takes? Is my resume okay?" Then you can either work with a resume writer. Maybe someone does it for free. I met a group of people and including that wonderful woman who did stuff like that for free kind of like, "All right. This is a job. This is my resume. Do they align?"
Raven Wilson:
And it's kind of really crafting my resume to fit these jobs in this style that I wanted to go for. So once I got that crafted and really fit the job, I started applying to jobs.
Lisa Hoashi:
Could you go a little bit more into detail about how did you start honing your experience? Because so many people have difficulty with that translation, right? I mean, really it's kind of like what you mentioned. It's like, first, the person has to have awareness that they're more than a teacher. They actually have these different things to offer. And then how to kind of translate them so they fit what a company is looking for. Right?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. So I think a lot of that goes with figuring out what you want to do. So before you can even translate your skills, you have to figure out what you want to do because when you're looking at something, a lot of people are like, "Well, what courses do I need to take to upskill? What should I apply to?" It's kind of like, "Well, what do you want to do?" Because maybe you don't need to do any of those things because you have all that you need.
Raven Wilson:
So when I look at a job description, when I'm reading one and it says like the must qualifications, must have experience in this type of software, I'm like, "Ooh." If I don't have that, I will write a list like, "This is what I have. This is what I want, must have experience onboarding new clients." So then it's really kind of understanding what does that mean? So this is where networking or Google is key or having to coach, asking someone, what is that? What is onboarding a new client?
Raven Wilson:
Onboarding a new client is teaching someone new how to do something. So as a teacher, have I ever taught someone new how to do something, especially when it comes to technology? Because I work in tech. Have I ever taught a colleague or maybe a parent how to do a new technology tool, use a new technology tool? Even if it's one person. Have I ever done that? Yes, I have. So I have that skill. So now it's being able to talk about that skill. Okay. Right?
Raven Wilson:
So it's in this like build relationships with multiple stakeholders. What does stakeholder mean? , Google it or ask someone, what does that mean? Okay. Build relationships with people in my organization and outside. Do I do that every day? Yes. Parents, principals, student. Okay. Boom. So it's really looking at the job description and understanding like, "This is what I've done. This is what I have done. I've created lessons and deliverables like little handouts. What have you have and what is the job description asking? And then you have that little glorious gap. What am I missing?
Raven Wilson:
If it's saying like, "I need to know all these tech skills, then maybe this is a position I need to upskill for. Maybe that's more instructional design or coding and I need to get that skill. But if it's something that I just need to onboard, build relationships, manage clients, we manage students. They're not clients, but you're still managing a caseload of students.
Raven Wilson:
So it's really being able to talk to that job and figuring out the jargon. You have to really be able to read through those terms. So Google like... What is on... Really understanding what does this stuff mean? And then looking at your resume or thinking through, "I have presented at multiple conferences. I can do that."
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. All right. So once you have your resume and you start applying and then it sounds like you start interviewing, how did that process go for you? What were some of the high points, the low points. How did that go?
Raven Wilson:
It's so funny because as a teacher, you feel like if I use a tech tool in my classroom, then of course, I'm going to apply to that job. And of course they're going to want to hire me because I've used your tool and I am a subject matter expert. So why would you not give me an interview? It does not work that way. It really does not. Applying for the big companies that we all know for like, "Wow. I use Google classroom every day. I'm going to apply for Google. I use Nearpod all the time. I'm going to apply for this. All these companies that I use all the time, I'm going to apply for them and I'm going to put all this stuff on my resume because they need me. It's absolutely false.
Raven Wilson:
It's just a false narrative. Yes, you use the product and that's awesome. You're a client, a customer, but what else can you offer the company? That was hard for me. Why am I getting all these rejections when you're seeing everybody else on LinkedIn, getting all these jobs. No one is really posting their struggles. I applied to 80 jobs and... So it's really getting through those rejections and then understanding why am I getting rejected? Maybe it's my resume. Maybe I'm applying to too many jobs, not like under the same umbrella. Maybe I need to stop applying for these huge companies and go smaller, go to medium size. Maybe I need to go to... I had to narrow down my search and before I got that resume crafted and everything like that. I had a very normal resume and I was sending it off like crazy.
Raven Wilson:
So I already applied to a lot of jobs and I was thinking like, "I can't apply to those again." That same lovely lady who gave me that advice, she always said like, "Why can't you? No one saw your resume to begin with. Apply again." So I had to go back and I started like, "Okay, those one jobs that I applied for before, I knew what I wanted to do. I'm going to apply again."
Raven Wilson:
So I started applying to those jobs beforehand again and that's when I started getting interviews too because I expanded my search instead of applying for the big 10 companies that everyone else was applying for.
Lisa Hoashi:
So it sounds like it was like over time you started to see, "Oh, I've got to continue kind of tweaking and going back and revising." And it's like, it's a very much-
Raven Wilson:
Process.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah.
Raven Wilson:
It's not like, "Oh, I have this resume. I'm going to apply." It's really like, "Okay, this company's mission is about maybe people and passion. I need to craft my resume to this mission in my cover letter. This company mission is about bubbles and stars." I need to really craft that about bubbles and stars. Not rewrite it, but craft it to what they're looking for. So it is very much to like go back, redo. I had a lot of Google Sheets and spreadsheets because I want to just keep track of where I was applying, learning how to network. It is very much so a process versus I'm going to apply to 50 places and someone is going to give me a job and feeling like they have to because I use this product.
Lisa Hoashi:
Do you want to just tell us about the amazing day where it all worked out?
Raven Wilson:
Yes. So I applied to this company that I applied before. This was my second time applying and I got an email. At first, I'm like, "Yeah, it's just one of those regular denial emails." And it was like, "You've been scheduled. We like to schedule you for a first round interview with the recruiter." And I'm like, "Aah." So that was like February 2021, like February 18th, 2021. And I got my first initial response via email like, "We want to schedule you for an interview." And that was so exciting. I was thinking I was really dramatic like, "Oh my gosh." Really researching how to interview and everything like that. And it was just with the recruiter.
Raven Wilson:
So it was a conversation. So after I got off the interview, I'm like, "That was never like anything I've done before." Then I know then I had five more interviews to come with that same company. So that was a process, like interviewing is completely different in corporate. It's not just one round and you got the job. It's multiple rounds, maybe like an activity or a task or presentation and then talking salary. And then I got the job.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. It's a big investment of time, right?
Raven Wilson:
It really is.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. I mean, the applications and resume are like one part of it. If you have multiple interviews or just, I mean, with multiple places, it's just like, it's a lot of work.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. I tell people all the time and they're like, "I want a job in August. I want to start applying in June." I'm like, "You probably should start a little bit earlier than that because it's a lot of time. It takes a lot of time.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. Just out of curiosity. How did you keep up your spirits and your energy during all of that time?
Raven Wilson:
I took breaks. So when I felt kind of down or when I didn't know what I wanted to do [inaudible 00:31:49] something else or like everyone is getting jobs and not me. I would take like a week off and say like, "You know what, I'm not focused." Because job hunting is another job. I'm not focusing on job hunting this week. I'm going to just take a break and then I'll come back at it the next week. Behind me, I had a whole sticky note countdown, up until like the end of the... When I would get a job end of the year, so I was like pulling it down day by day.
Raven Wilson:
I was just excited. I just knew that I was going to get a job so I'm like, "I don't care what anyone says. I'll take a break if I need to. I just was passionate. It's exhausting, yes, but if I wasn't applying for jobs, I'm going to network and meet people and hopefully that's going to help me out."
Lisa Hoashi:
One thing that I just spoke about in one of the podcast episodes was just like, it's not all over once you get the job. So will you tell us what happens then?
Raven Wilson:
Once you get the job? No, no. Oh, gosh. Well, first of all, it's a learning curve, especially if you're changing careers. You're still learning all the time. I think I'm about six or seven months in, into my new company and I'm still... Some days I'm like, "What's happening?" The learning curve is still there. I still feel very new sometimes. I'm still learning the product. And I'm still networking and meeting people because what if one day I don't want to work at this company anymore or, I don't want to do customer success anymore?
Raven Wilson:
So I'm just not going to be like, "Oh, well, this is my job for the next 20 years." Like the presence of networking and community building is still there. And also you still want to grow within the company. I still want to be a subject matter expert at customer success. So I'm still trying to learn and understand how do I become better at this? So no, the work, it's constant. It stays constant.
Lisa Hoashi:
So at that point, had you already done your goodbyes or did you have to do your goodbyes at the time that you were also about to start your job?
Raven Wilson:
I left before spring break. So like the week before spring break. And I just sent my goodbyes to people who I knew and I was close with. They already knew I was job searching. So I had let them know. When I got the job, I let them know. I did my goodbyes to everyone else like a mass email. Luckily, we were a hybrid because that was COVID. So we were in school some days, out of school some days. I did a massive email goodbyes. My principal was very sort of that's hard for a lot of people. But I also told her ahead of time. I didn't just be like, "Surprise, I'm leaving." Because you do need her for a reference. That is the manager.
Raven Wilson:
So I let her know during like midway interview process when I had a feeling that I was going to get the job, like, "Hey, I want to let you know that I'm pursuing this new passion." And she was very supportive. So she already knew too. So I let a lot of people know upfront who needed to know, and then everyone else I just did like the mass like, "Thank you so much. Here's my contact. If you ever need anything, let me know."
Lisa Hoashi:
Okay. It's always hard to say goodbye and to kind of let that go.
Raven Wilson:
It is, yes. I was really excited. I'm not going to lie. I was very excited.When I got the job. I'm like, "Yes. Bye, everyone."
Lisa Hoashi:
School is out forever.
Raven Wilson:
Oh, yes.
Lisa Hoashi:
All right. So to just kind of switch gears, something that I thought was really great about your story was that you are now passionate about helping other black educators who are interested in leaving teaching. So will you tell us a little bit about what you have created?
Raven Wilson:
Yes. So before I created my own thing, I started volunteering with this group called Teaching: a Path to L&D or TPLD. And they were this amazing free group who really poured into educators who were trying to lead teaching and get into L&D, learning and development. That really looked a lot like instructional design. But I wanted any free resources I could get, because it's expensive to get people to do things for you. So they were hosting resume webinars, interview prep, any and everything they had.
Raven Wilson:
So what I did was start volunteering with them first. I was like, I wanted to give back to the people who gave to me. And so I volunteer with them for about a year. And it was amazing because I'm helping teachers all the time. They know they're talking to me. It was amazing and also very draining.
Raven Wilson:
I mean to rephrase that because it's exhausting helping people all the time for free. That's really exhausting. So in that process, I started to see something that I wasn't seeing many black women leaving. Or when I did see black women, they all said the same thing like, "Raven, I picked on your face on the mentor page because you were black. I know you're not doing instructional design, but I really want to talk to you because you look like me." And I'm like, "Man." I got that a lot when I did see black women come or black teachers in general come in and out. I say women because there's only a few male teachers. So my group was for anyone, but there's a few-
Lisa Hoashi:
The majority is women.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. The majority is women. There's like five men. So I'm like, "Wow, there may be a need for this." So I talked with the TPLD creator and I'm like, "Hey, just kind of getting heard. How did you start your group? What does that look like?" I really want to do my own, but for black educators, because I really feel like there's a space for that, because there's really not a lot of people in corporate that are black teachers who are leaving in these careers, and I think it's a space. She kind of really helped me figure out my plan. And so then I crafted a group called Black Educators Transition to do the same, to help teachers who are looking to go to kind of give them the resources.
Raven Wilson:
This is where you need to start. This is what you need to do. You need to... Not holding anyone's hand because, again, you have to do the work yourself, but this is a beginning place for you to start your transition.
Lisa Hoashi:
And so what does your group now provide to black educators?
Raven Wilson:
So right now we're still in the very beginning. When did I launch it? What month is this? We are in March?
Lisa Hoashi:
April.
Raven Wilson:
April. So I launched it officially in February. We're about like a month and a half in and we have over 500 members. So right now I do webinars or series. So it's very like, "This is where you start, transition. If you're looking to start, this is what you need to do." And then the next one would be like, "Now, that you know what you want to do, let's craft a resume. Here's how you craft a resume by yourself or here's some services that you can pay for." And then number three, we go to like, "Okay, now that you've crafted your resume, here are some job titles or maybe that switch. What do you want to do, job titles, resumes?
Raven Wilson:
And after that, we talk about networking with LinkedIn. And then I also post like jobs that are hiring, ed tech, regular tech, FinTech, any jobs that are hiring. We do salary negotiations. Just resources, tips and motivation. All of it's free unless someone wants specialized services. So if they're like, "Raven, I really want you to look at my resume," then that's a little different. But again, I will say like, "Here's a great group, you can join. These are people that you want to follow on LinkedIn."
Raven Wilson:
I made a video the other day, literally of my resume. This is how I crafted my resume. These are the terms that this is how I would do a resume. And this week I'm doing like a LinkedIn one. This is how you maximize your LinkedIn. This is how you use it. Just tips and resources for teachers [inaudible 00:38:58].
Lisa Hoashi:
Cool. Yeah. So you just started like a month and a half ago and you already have 500 members?
Raven Wilson:
I know, it's crazy.
Lisa Hoashi:
I think you discovered a need there.
Raven Wilson:
And it's only on Facebook too. I didn't even put it on LinkedIn yet, which is a whole-
Lisa Hoashi:
So this is like a Facebook group where people join? Yeah.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah.
Lisa Hoashi:
Okay. So I imagine it's like nationwide, you're getting people from across the US.
Raven Wilson:
Everywhere. Yeah, I wanted to do like meetups, but I'm like, "Everyone lives everywhere." So eventually I would love to do networking meetups where we sit. Because we have people in the group who were former teachers, but now are out like me and they come in and provide tips. Someone posted the other day like, "I got this offer, how do I negotiate? "And then people are giving tips. This is how you negotiate your salary. And it's just a beautiful place to be, to help women get out of teaching, if they want to and find the career of their dreams.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. So recently on LinkedIn, I noticed that you posted an article. I'm going to read it. So it was in ed week and they talked about how there was recently a surge of teachers who were leaving post-COVID, leaving the profession and that the majority or the biggest numbers were Black or Latino teachers. I mean, judging from your group, it sounds like you've also hit on like a number of those people who are wanting to leave the profession. I was just curious what are you hearing from teachers and why do you think that those numbers might be higher for black teachers specifically?
Raven Wilson:
That's a good question. I don't know. I don't know, because I feel like the amount of black teachers and Latino teachers to white teachers is disproportionate, right? Teaching is a predominantly white profession. So that's first and foremost. So I feel like the numbers of leaving would be bigger of Black and Latino because it's less. So I don't know. So I feel like that's that kind of skews a little bit, because there's not many... I mean, you can ask a lot of people, how many Black teachers are in your building? Who probably can tell you with two hands, there's 10, there's five.
Raven Wilson:
But I feel a lot of the black women that I talk to are very much so like, "Yeah, I want more money. I've learned my work. I want more money. I love these kids." But especially if they're younger teachers, the older teachers, like 60s, they're kind of like, "I'm stuck here." But the 30s, early 40s are like, "I want more money. Tired of being beat down. I have my own kids to take care of. I'm not saving anyone." So that's what I'm seeing around black teachers. But I'm also seeing the same thing for white women that I talk to too. They're all like, "Yeah, no." So I don't-
Lisa Hoashi:
In general, there's a feeling of like lack of support [inaudible 00:41:54]. The demands are too high in general, but also for the amount of money that you're being paid.
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. The cost it just doesn't make sense because I talk to all types of teachers. My services help any teachers, but my group specifically is for black educators, but my resume, coaching, I will help anyone. I was talking to a white teacher yesterday and she's like, "I can't do this anymore. I don't make enough money. I'm really exhausted." And the same thing for the black educator. It's the same reasons. I think the numbers are a little different because of what the demographics look like within teaching.
Lisa Hoashi:
When the educators join your group and... I mean, I imagine you're getting a lot of the initial questions, right? So what are some of the classic initial questions that people have?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. And this is even goes to anyone who messages me on LinkedIn too. Sometimes it's like, "I saw that you were an educator. I am too. I would love to hear more about what you do." That's number one. I would love to hear more about what you want to do." And that's my new question is just like a statement. Number two, it's like, "I don't know what to do." That's the biggest one, "I don't know what I can do besides teaching." That one is huge and that one takes, and I promise you the most work because it's really like you said like that-
Lisa Hoashi:
It's very specific to the person.
Raven Wilson:
I'm always like, "I can't tell you what you want to do. I cannot. I can tell you how to figure it out, but I cannot say like, "Hey, you look like you would love writing content and maybe you hate that." So that's the biggest one which is the hardest one I get all the time. Number two, was it hard to do it? How long did it take? You go on salary. Did you take a pay cut? How does retirement work? I would say like, "What jobs are out there?" A lot of people, they know that they can go. They just don't know what jobs they can do. "Can you help with my resume?" That's another big one, my resume. "I've applied for like 29 jobs and I'm not getting anything. What am I doing wrong?" So a lot of those questions that I get usually.
Lisa Hoashi:
And I'd love to hear some of your answers. I mean, we've heard the one of like, "I don't know what I want to do." We heard that one. So what about when people ask you about how long will it take?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah. So I tell people all the time like your journey looks different than anybody else. That's a loaded question. You meet someone, it can take three months. It can take three. You meet a lot of people. I say a few things. It really depends on how bad you want it and how much work you're going to put into it. I always say plan from-
Lisa Hoashi:
This is what I think coaching is.
Raven Wilson:
Yes, it really does. It really depends on you.
Lisa Hoashi:
You're the one doing the work.
Raven Wilson:
It depends on you. And a lot of people think they want it better than they actually do. Or in their brain, they're like, "I want it so bad, but they're not putting in the work to actually do it." It's a lot like working out. Right? "Ah, I want to work out." But you're not actually doing it, so you're not going to see the results. So I always say like, "It really depends on you." How much time can you dedicate to doing what you need to do to get the job? I always tell people like maybe six to eight months. Sometimes sooner. If you're doing it like if you're being very strategic.
Raven Wilson:
So again, but my biggest one is it depends on you. But I would say give it a school year if you're being strategic. So that's number one. I would say that. When someone asks me like, "I'm applying for all these jobs, why am I not getting anything back?" I say a few things. I say, "One, it's probably your resume." That's my first thought. It's probably your resume. Your resume is not correct. And then you get a lot of pushback like, "I had someone write it for me. I did this, I did that."
Raven Wilson:
And I'm like, "It's still probably your resume. But okay. Two, you probably didn't niche down, which means you probably have not figured out what you want it to do. So you're probably applying for five different jobs titles with that same resume that needs work. And number three, you're probably in a box with applying. You see what everyone else is applying to on LinkedIn, so you're applying to all those jobs. Get out of the box. You don't need to just go to ed tech. There's so many versions of tech that you can go to. There's so many, many non-tech companies that you can go to do anything. So you're in a box of what you're applying to." So those are usually my three things of like, "I've applied to all these jobs. Nothing is happening."
Lisa Hoashi:
What's your response about the pay cut? Do people have to be prepared to take a pay cut?
Raven Wilson:
I always say no. Again, it depends on what you are willing to take. You do not have to take an entry level position because we're not entry level people. Yes, we may be new to a job, but we're not entry level. It depends on what you want and where you live is a very big one. I get a lot of California teachers talking to me. So I'm always like, "Okay, you may end up taking a pay cut because you live in... As a teacher, you make 90 grand." But I'm very big on, "No, don't accept the job." You can say no. You don't have to accept a job if you find out their salary is $50,000 and you want 75. Or if you want to take a pay cut, yes, you don't have to stay at that job... You can go much faster to another company like I did. You can leave."
Raven Wilson:
I'm always saying, "No, you don't have a budget in yourself." When you know what you want, you're like, "I want be a content creator. I want to make $85,000. I want to do this." Those are your must haves. Then you now need to apply to companies that are like that.
Lisa Hoashi:
Yeah. It has so much to do with mindset. And like what you decide is going to be your number. What are you going to take? What are you going after?
Raven Wilson:
And honestly, like this salary, everything. And a lot of teachers don't realize that you can talk more than just salary, like base salary. Can you negotiate PTO? Maybe you want to have kids soon. We can talk maternity leave. Maybe you want a sign-on bonus. There are other parts that will kind of fix that salary if you take like a $10,000 pay cut. Teachers who I would work with who live around me, I'm always telling them, "You're not taking a pay cut. We make nothing. You're going to get a pay raise regardless."
Lisa Hoashi:
Well, and as a teaching specific question, do you get asked how do you feel about losing summers off?
Raven Wilson:
Yes. Oh, I forgot about that one. Yes. How do I feel about summers? How do I feel about breaks? That's a big one. In my brain, I thought I was going to be a lot sadder. I thought it was going to be like gut wrenching like, "Oh man, all my teacher friends are out having fun in the summer and I'm working." It does not feel that way. Prime example. This is spring break week for teachers where I live. I'm off. I was off yesterday. I'm I'm working today. But I'm off Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday, because I want to, because I can. We have that opportunity. My son is three. He doesn't really get his spring break, but I'm like, "Let's just go to Bus Garden."
Raven Wilson:
I can do that with him and there's no pushback. Same thing for summer. One I work remote. So if I wanted to take a vacation and I had to work, I can just take my computer with me and get some work done. Two, vacation and PTO is very flexible. There is no time constraint. I don't have to just take vacations in the summer. I can take them whenever I want to. I don't feel any different. I'm not exhausted after work. So when I get off work, I can go to the beach.
Raven Wilson:
It's not give or take. Or maybe if I don't have any meetings, I can work from the beach. So it's so flexible. I don't really miss it. And also my husband is not a teacher and he doesn't get off summertime. So it's not like-
Lisa Hoashi:
It's not like that was working out perfectly anyway.
Raven Wilson:
Yes. I'm like, fine. My kid goes to daycare. It's fine. I'm working. I get off. We still do things. So I don't feel different for not working summers at all.
Lisa Hoashi:
All right. Well, that was a mandatory question to ask.
Raven Wilson:
It's a good question. I already have three vacations plan this summer. I already took the kids and it's fine. It's not like... It's like, "Okay, see you when you get back."
Lisa Hoashi:
Well, Raven, I have so appreciated all your tips and just you sharing your story. Is there anything that you feel like maybe you wanted to talk about that we left out?
Raven Wilson:
I want to mention really fast to anyone who has to feel like they have to take a pay cut or they're taking a job, the salary is not where they want it to, because I was just working with someone on LinkedIn about this yesterday. Maybe you got a job and you're like, "Man, I really wanted to make 85,000 and this company's only offering 65." But you want to take it anyway, because again, you ready to go? You can take that job and you can leave eventually.
Raven Wilson:
You don't have to stay there. That doesn't have to be, again, like a 10-year position. That can be a six-month position. Learn what you need to learn as that position. Get in there. Get your resume wrote and apply for another job. I did the same thing with my first company. I was there. It wasn't a right fit for me. And I also wanted more money. I left after six months.
Raven Wilson:
It's easier to move company to company. You're not stuck if you ever feel like that. So that's a big thing I tell people all the time. It's okay to leave. It really is okay.
Lisa Hoashi:
Well, that's also like just another interesting mindset thing because if you've been a teacher and it's like a fairly static profession, then you're just not accustomed to moving from company to company, which is often usually the way people get those pay bumps, right?
Raven Wilson:
Yeah.
Lisa Hoashi:
It's every time they leave a company now. They're getting an increase in their salary. So it's like the easiest way to get an increase.
Raven Wilson:
And they say the best time to look for a job is when you already have one. And it's the quickest way to increase your salary is to move companies. I always tell people like, "You love teaching. That was the hardest thing." Leaving this company should not feel anywhere as hard as teaching. So go.
Lisa Hoashi:
You've already done it.
Raven Wilson:
Exactly. You already did the hardest thing you did and your resume is in much better shape and you have experience. So if you ever feel like, "Man, this is not really the salary I wanted. Stay for a little bit, get that experience and then you can go." I told anyone you can still leave. Change careers if you want to. You don't always have to do the same career. If you get into a customer success and hate it, companies allow you to like, "Oh, maybe you want to do this." They will let you do that.
Lisa Hoashi:
Great advice. Thank you, Raven. So the last thing we'll do is I'll ask you the three questions that I ask every guest. And the first one is, "What do you wish you had known before you took your leap?"
Raven Wilson:
I wish I would've known that there were more careers than the ones that you see immediately on your search. Because when you feel like you have to just pick one, you get stuck and you feel like your options are just... You feel like you're just tied down to one thing. So I wish I would've known like the world is bigger than the one thing that pops up on Google.
Lisa Hoashi:
And what was something that was maybe surprising or unexpected about your leap?
Raven Wilson:
How low paying some of the big ed tech companies pay. How low the salaries are. You really think you're going to... It's tech. You're going to make six figures immediately. Some of these companies that we all want to apply to may not be as big salaries as you think they are. Like I was saying before, you really got to get out of that box of like, "I'm only going to apply to five, because I love them." Sometimes those are not the places that you want to work for. Also, learning your working style. Do I like startups? Do I want a company that's already been maintained? That's that's a big one too.
Lisa Hoashi:
That's great advice. And for someone who is thinking of doing something similar, what advice would you have for them?
Raven Wilson:
I would say start taking inventory now of skills that you have, things that you like, so you can figure out what you want to do. So if you know now like, "Man, I've been thinking about this a lot and I'm really interested in training." If you're in the position to start doing things within your school district now to put on your resume, start it now. So take inventory of what you like, figure out what you want to do. And like, "Ooh, I want to start training." Ask your principal to lead a PD. Start tracking data. Start getting that information down so when you're crafting that resume you have things to talk about.
Lisa Hoashi:
Well, thank you so much for joining us today, Raven. If people want to be in touch with you or if they want to join your group, how can they find out more?
Raven Wilson:
Yes. So you can always connect with me on LinkedIn, Raven Wilson. I'll give you my link to put in the show notes.
Lisa Hoashi:
Definitely.
Raven Wilson:
And you can always find my group on Facebook and it's Black Educators Transition. So LinkedIn, you can connect. I help anyone if you ever just want help to connect or look at your resume, anything like that. I'll give my calendar too. You can schedule with on my calendar. We do coaching. I do coaching, resume services, giving you jobs, description, everything like that. However, if you are a black educator looking for a space of teachers who really look like you and a space to feel safe, please, please, please join my group, black Educators Transition on Facebook.
Lisa Hoashi:
Awesome. Well, thank you so much. It's been a pleasure having you on thank you for sharing your story and so much learning that you are now passing on to other people. Thank you.
Raven Wilson:
Thank you so much for having me. This was great.
Lisa Hoashi:
I love that conversation and I hope that you also got tons of good ideas from Raven. She had so much to share. I want to encourage you if you would like to know more about how you can connect with Raven or about what she's up to, if you want to kind of review some of the points that we talked about, head on over to my website, lisahoashi.com/podcast for the show notes for this episode.
Lisa Hoashi:
And also, I want you to know that if you are at that sort of stage where you are trying to figure out what do you want out of your next role, what role would be a good fit for you? And you want to do some of that self-reflection, self-assessment that Raven and I were talking about, I have something that is going to help you do that. I have a self-paced digital course that is called Illuminate Your Career Path in Five Steps. You can get access to it right now over at my website, lisahoashi.com/career-course.
Lisa Hoashi:
And this course has five different modules that will take you through step by step, how to do some of this initial planning and thinking about what do you want next for your career path? What job would be a good fit for you? It starts helping you with some exercises, really easy to do, to think about what do you like doing at work? What do you not like doing? And to get you starting to think about what kind of roles would be the right match for you.
Lisa Hoashi:
So if you want to learn more, again, the link is lisahoashi.com/career-course. It is there for you, and you can always of course access that in the show notes for the podcast, or reach out to me with a DM or send me a quick email, and I am happy to answer any of your questions about that. Until next week, I hope you have a great one. Thanks again for listening.
Lisa Hoashi:
Thank you for listening to this episode of Leap Like Me. If you're enjoying this show and getting lots of value from it, be sure to hit that subscribe button so you don't miss any new episodes and leave us a five star review. Also, do you know anyone who's considering a career change who might appreciate the ideas and inspiration from this show? Please let them know about it. We want as many people as possible to benefit from these shows and know that if you do share it, you can always tag me @lisahoashi on Instagram or LinkedIn.
Lisa Hoashi:
By the way, if you haven't already connected with me in those two places, I'm also sharing tons of good stuff there. Speaking of sharing, I want you to know about my new free Change Planner. This planner is for you, if you'd like to make a significant change in life or work, but you're feeling kind of stuck.
Lisa Hoashi:
My Change Planner will help you get the clarity you need to take your next steps. Inside, I'll show you how to understand what you really want and why it's important, how to face your fears constructively so they don't hold you back. And this planner also has a scenario cruncher. I help you get all possible scenarios out of your head so you can find the right one for you. It's my favorite part. And having used it with many clients, I've seen how powerful it is.
Lisa Hoashi:
I know you're going to get many great insights out of this free planner. So head on over to leaplikeme.com to get your copy. That's a wrap for this episode. Thanks for listening, for sharing this show, and being part of this journey with me. Take good care.